Daniel: Hey, Sue. It's a pleasure. Thanks for having me. 

Sue: So, Daniel is joining us from Poland, which is where his home base is. So thanks for taking the time out of your day and aligning our schedules, because I'm so excited for everyone to meet you and learn all about what you do in this important industry. Many, many people ask us, what is color forecasting? They don't necessarily know and understand what it means. So tell us a little bit about how you got into this industry, and where did it all begin for you?

Daniel: That's quite an interesting story, actually, Sue. So for me, there was no urge. I didn't wake up one day and think, "Oh, I'm going to be in the color forecasting industry." In fact, it was more by accident. Many moons ago, I packed myself up from London and went to study biology at the University of Texas because I had ambitions of becoming a dentist. So after about a year and a half of struggling with advanced math classes and contemplating the idea of staring into people's mouths for eternity, I jumped ship and studied interior design. I graduated in 2009. It was the height of the banking recession. I shipped myself back to London. Nobody wanted a newbie. I could not get a job anywhere. And so, I fell into Global Colour Research, which is now Colour Hive, and I was hired as a print production assistant and also the RAL agent for the UK and Ireland. And that essentially is my start within the color forecasting industry, happenstance.  

Sue: I did not even know that side of it. So what does that mean in the print and the print side of it? Educate us a little bit on that process from a technical perspective. What did you have to do there?  

Daniel: Yeah, certainly. So a lot of the work that Colour Hive does is developing and designing and creating publications or accurate color sampling tools. So fan decks or trend books with actual chips of real paint and things like that. So everything is manufactured, and at that time, by some factories in Germany. So it was this accurate representation of color outside of the realms of basic CMYK printing.  
Sue: So our audience is really familiar with paint trends. We talk about that a lot through our color forecasting process. But what is the difference with Colour Hive? And talk about what the predictions that you make from a product development standpoint.  
Daniel: So for Colour Hive, we really specialize in forecasting design directions two years ahead of the season. So we're obsessed with how color, material, and finishes work collectively to create new and exciting design outcomes. So I think it's important to note we're not fashion forecasters, far from it. Our design directions really transcend an array of different industries, anywhere from consumer electronics to lifestyle product, kitchen appliances, of course, coatings as well. It's a big part of what we do. And now, not every design direction or forecast that we predict is going to be applicable to every industry, but it's our role as experts and as a consultancy to advise our clients on the best or the right ones to use for their markets and their consumers.  
Sue: So with such a big, broad reach, that's a lot of industries, and again, like you said, it's not every single industry, but how does your team go about that research, because it's monumental, really?  
Daniel: Yeah. So research obviously plays a huge part in what we do. I mean, we spend hundreds and, well, thousands of hours, it seems, on research. So pushing aside the editorial side of Colour Hive, we're a wide-reaching editorial team, so we get a lot of research like that. We're not just a group of designers or people in an office deciding what's hot and what's not. We work through a very rigorous process to develop our intelligence or design directions as it were. And we work with industry professionals from all different industries around the world, and we tap into their insight, their knowledge, their insight in the form of panel meetings. So collectively getting together to hash out what's coming, and what's leaving as well, which is also extremely important. And then from that point, we work with contributors who look at the work we're developing with these industry professionals, and then we tap into their insight and knowledge as well from a regional perspective. So research comes in many forms, but ultimately, we start with qualified people who are at the top of their industries, who are working with color, who understand it, and they know where it's been and where it's going.  
Sue: And then would you say that regionalism has a play there? Do you look at just the whole world, or do you focus in on core regions? How does that work?  
Daniel: Ultimately, we start from a global perspective. You have to, I think. And there are always going to be synergies between regions in terms of a global response to a design direction or a forecast as it were. But regions absolutely come into play. They have to. So we cover North America, South America, or should I say Latin America, sorry, Europe, Africa, India, New Zealand, Australia, and Asia Pacific. But it's hugely important. I mean, even if you look at North America as an example, something that is working on the West may not necessarily be working on the East. I mean, that's a very unique region in itself. And the same with India. So regional input is hugely important to making sure that the directions that we forecast are meaningful and applicable and really commercially viable for anyone who's tapping into our output.  
Sue: Is there any direction that you get from those regions that are really unique? How is North America different in the color predictions than Latin America or India? I'm curious if you can, just from your perspective, talk about cultural associations and how that makes color change region to region, from your perspective.  
Daniel: Well, I think you've hit the nail on the head in terms of culture. So culture does differ. People's response to color choice or selection differs often based on where they're placed culturally. So Latin America, we often see a lot of bright and vibrant colors, as where if we consider the east coast of North America, I would suggest maybe it's more heritage. You head off into Europe, Scandinavian color choice plays a huge part there. And then you get into India, and there's really big differences across that country as you move along in terms of the region that you're in. Yeah. So I mean, it's a fascinating world, but ultimately, color or color choice or preferences is subjective, and it's emotive to the end user.  
Sue: So then we've been looking at this big worldview of color, and then you narrow it down by region, and then that helps guide that directional color. But then if you're working as a consultancy with a product development or a customer, how then do you get in and really determine what's the right path for the particular product that you're working on?  
Daniel: So that's additional research. So we want to, one, understand the client. It's important to understand the client, the brand. We want to get down to the very nitty-gritty, the ethos of what that client is, who they are. And then from that point, we want to home in on specifics. Is this a particular product? Okay, yes. Are you targeting someone specific? Is this the younger generation, the older generation? Is this product going to be focused just in one market or is it going to be focused globally? So once we have all of those parameters, that then allows us to formulate a research approach. And from that approach, we then home in and we start to look specifically at the things that would affect the outcome of that project in terms of the direction that they want to go.  
Sue: So a way to look at this from somebody that's a listener that's maybe not really familiar with why this is important, we can talk about the iPhone. In 2015, was that the year of rose gold, '14, '15? So Apple decided to take a risk and put color on an iPhone, and that was really I think one of the first colors that they went with outside of gray and black and silver, probably. And it was a huge impact globally. Obviously Apple is a huge brand and has a ton of influence, but that color selection permeated product development and interior design for seasons to come. The whole world fell in love with that pinky champagne tone, and we had not been really talking about it. So from a product development standpoint, these colors, and they are so well researched, they have global impact. So my question to you is, obviously as an authority in this space, what's the line between predicting and setting trends? And is part of the work you do a self-fulfilling prophecy? So people come to you, you know these [inaudible 00:10:10] the colors, you have this oracle and this magic ball. And how does that impact how things sell?  
Daniel: We always get asked this question, or there's always someone who comes up and says, "I don't follow trends." And I get it. That's kind of what you think. If it were a self-fulfilling prophecy, there would be no sale racks or bargain buckets. Institutions like the TK or TJ Maxx, Marshalls, the pound store, dollar store, they would cease to exist. So I think ultimately a color or trend, it really has to chime with public consciousness. So if it doesn't, it fails, and it can fail really, really badly. So I can understand why people might think that's what's happening, but it definitely doesn't work like that. And I think there's enough stuff out there to really showcase if you think that, well, no, it's not self-fulfilling. And these things do fail, and that's just the lay of the land. I thought it was interesting that you picked up on the iPhone actually, because for the longest time, one would suggest that trends often followed fashion, but I think as time has moved on, consumer electronics or the automotive industry have a huge impact on color choice and how that filters down into interiors and the built environment.  
Sue: So talk about that a little bit. People probably don't know how much research goes into automotive color selection, and obviously product development in the tech space.  
Daniel: It's absolutely huge. Colour Hive works for consumer electronics, Samsung as an example. They have huge budgets. They pour tons of time and money into CMF projects for their devices or the cases that carry their devices. And they could actually employ multiple agencies at the same time who are working on the same project. These projects are then submitted. They themselves then would use focus groups or panel meetings as a source to look at things and really home in and decide on which one is going to work for them and their market. And if you're good at what you do, some of the work you've completed for the client gets selected, and you actually see that come to market. And that's always a really exciting time for a company like Colour Hive. It's so important. Everyone thinks a green is a green or a yellow is a yellow. It's just so not the case. These tints and tones are so important, and it can take months just to select one perfect color because that one perfect color is going to make or break your product. And I can't express the amount of time that is put into selecting something that is so important in terms of tech or even automotive.  
Sue: Could you... And if you can't talk about it, that's fine, but has Colour Hive had a mic drop moment that people would recognize, like a color that you really worked on and it got commercialized? Is there anything you could share?  
Daniel: The Samsung Galaxy 10, those colorways that came out for that, we were integral to that process for sure.  
Sue: That's awesome. One thing I would point out, and I just have recently noticed it, and it's probably something that you've been working on for a while now, in new car launches here in the United States, I'm not sure about globally, I've noticed that color is flattening a little bit, so there's a little less metallic. The colors are really clean. Automotive colors usually have a lot of glisten and sparkle and layers of texture and finish in that color, and now color's flattening out a little bit. It reads as if it's a flat color. And there is sort of layers in there, but it's less sparkly, it's less shiny, it's less glisten-y. Have you worked on those trends for the automotive industry?  
Daniel: Not per se, because Colour Hive doesn't specifically work within the automotive industry, but we're definitely noticing the same change in those color palettes across Europe as well. You're seeing it a lot now.  
Sue: It's an exciting change. It looks a little throwback, which it hearkens for me back to the '70s when it was less about the technology of paint on cars, and the color reads really true, and it's noticeable. So I can tell immediately when there's new cars driving by, only simply just, not from the design of the car, but just from the color. And I'm sure people listening will start to notice that as well, which is kind of cool.  
Daniel: Nostalgia is such a big part in that as well. And we're at a time where nostalgia makes you feel warm and fuzzy.  
Sue: It does.  
Daniel: So I think that's why those colors are coming through.  
Sue: People don't know this, but we work closely together. I lean into Colour Hive and the research for the work that informs what we do. We have a really nice collaboration. I love your team, it's amazing. So I appreciate you coming on and introducing yourself to the world. Tell me about what's exciting about what you do, and also what's hard. This is not an easy job, so talk a little bit about that.  
Daniel: Yeah. So I mean, for me, I think from a consultancy point of view, I'm at the beginning stage of a project. So it's always, a client comes to us and says, "We need this, this, this, and that." And then I get to go away and sit with my teams and actually work out what it is the client actually needs. And I think, from that point, watching how then creativity can flare, and we start to develop and work on innovative solutions, on how color and material can express itself in new ways and really benefit the client, I think that's probably... and those outcomes, that's the most exciting part for me, is starting that process with a discussion, and then seeing the actual end outcome and meeting the client's expectation in terms of the deliverable, and then watching that process as it grows commercially. I think from a difficult standpoint, everyone at Colour Hive would probably agree that there is never enough time or space to do all of the things that we want to do.  
Sue: That is certainly true, and your team is so thoughtful. And we'll talk a little bit about how people can find more about Colour Hive and subscribe and learn more, but your team is so thoughtful. So the editorials that are put out, the things that you publish in your MIX Magazine, they're so well done. And it's great to know the behind-the-scenes of that because I totally... Anything that your team talks about, I trust and believe, because I know how much research goes into it and I know how difficult that is. When we talk about the paint and coatings industry, breakthrough moments are really important because there's a lot of noise in this color and trend space, particularly from the coating side. How does Colour Hive break through the noise? Is it continuity and consistency, or do you have any insight that you could share into how you break through the noise, if you will?  
Daniel: Yeah, in fact, it's one of our taglines, "Break through the noise." So I think-  Sue: I did not know that, I promise.  Daniel: I think continuity and consistency is key to the process. So I think there's often this idea or concept around forecasting and predictions that everything has to be new. Well, that is not the reality in the way in which things work. So our design directions evolve. So they're built layer upon layer upon layer upon layer. They're built around these macro trend drivers and how they filter down, and help to develop the narrative around what those stories are. And it's all backed up, in terms of the research that we do, but then also we continue to follow. So a year on from our first forecast, we look at it in terms of color now. So we start to see how some of those directions and color palettes and material directions are starting to be picked up in the form of what we call early adopters, so people at the forefront of those actual directions as they start to bring it to mass market. And so, I think pushing aside all of the marketing gimmicks around color and so forth, it is that continuity of the direction and how it progresses season upon season, in terms of the color shift or change within that color landscape.  
Sue: And that's what's really important for people to understand. So trends just don't drop in out of nowhere. Homeowners get frustrated sometimes. They're like, "We don't want a trend color. We want something that's more timeless." But I think it's important to understand the continuity aspect, that these colors really... They move at a rhythm, and they don't just come in and out really quickly because of this cycle of trend forecasting. So again, I want you to talk about it, I don't want to blab on. Can you talk about how, from a consumer perspective, designers, homeowners, they can rely on predictive trends to help them in their interior environment? Did I say that in a way that makes sense?  
Daniel: I think so. I think so. I think it's... Absolutely, you can rely on it. And sometimes in terms of consumer choice, especially at mass market level, you have to rely on it, because at that point within the purchasing process, that is what is in front of you. But I think it's... As I said earlier, color is really so subjective in terms of the person who is looking to utilize or purpose that particular color. So looking at a forecast or a direction, there are many out there. You just have to find the right one that fits with you. And things are cyclic. So a color that was popular in the 1970s is going to at some point reemerge, whether you call that timeless or not, or dated. I mean, again, that's another subjective choice in itself as well. But I think there are many opportunities for people to home in on things that work for them. I think also what we're doing is very future focused. So we're two to five years ahead of actually things being released. And so that's important from a commercial perspective for the company, because that's generally the life span in which it takes for a product to be concepted and then actually put on a shelf in a store. But it's not always about changing on a regular basis. In fact, that's clearly a direction that we're moving away from anyway. But nonetheless, predictive color palettes or material palettes and so forth are hugely important. And I think also because it just drives innovation in terms of the future and where things also need to go from a sustainable perspective as well.  
Sue: So we had talked just a little bit, you had teased it out, that it used to be fashion was a driver of where color was going to go. And in the '80s and '90s, that was like a predictive model we could lean into. Talk about how that's different now.  
Daniel: Actually many, many years ago, Global Colour Research, now Colour Hive, they actually started off as fashion forecasters, but the person who started the company quite quickly decided to move away from it. Fashion now is too fast. What's here today is gone tomorrow, and there's no real continuity in that process. And so, from our perspective, it's important that anything we develop or predict has longevity to it. And it has to be in today's markets, in today's industries, to make color selection or application commercially viable. And so, while fashion is still extremely important, absolutely we're watching the catwalks, we're looking and absorbing all of that, it's not the main driving force any more for color forecasting or prediction. We're interested in lots of other things as well, politics, the environment, technological advancements, anything that will ultimately emerge down the line as a consumer preference is really what we're looking at. So nothing is irrelevant, but there isn't one thing now really pushing or driving that process. It's an amalgamation of so much more. And I think that in itself makes color directions or design directions much more meaningful and much more... They make it available to the general consumer, rather than the high end consumer, as it were.  
Sue: I agree. So this year we launched, instead of a singular color of the year, we went with a color capsule of the year, so nine colors. We curated this collection to expand the reach of colors, to your point. It's not just one thing any more. It's not just one note. We really have gotten feedback from our homeowners, our designers, our clients, that they want to know about more color because they use the application so differently. So it can be this, and it can be that. It doesn't just have to be one color is the hottest thing. It can be light neutrals, it can be a deeper shade, and those things exist in the same space. And I think that's an important nuance as we move forward. People are exposed to so much information. There's so much color information in the digital space, there's so much inspiration. So we have to react to that as well and take on color in a different way. And I think it's going to be a fun transition. People are excited about color, they're ready to get into color, they're ready to bring it into their home. And we're absolutely seeing that here in North America. But from your perspective, what do you guys see as design on the rise, on the horizon that people should pay attention to or take note of, from an interior design perspective?  
Daniel: There's so much. There's so much. Me, personally, I'm really interested in the reemergence of ancient practice in terms of craftsmanship. So how traditional materials are working with production techniques to showcase this connection between the maker and the environment. So I'm starting to see some really, really beautiful foraged clay pieces come to market, and I find them quite stunning. They just feel so natural and rugged, and I think we're going to start to see a lot of that in the coming year. But more excitedly, for me, is how some of the unexpected ancient practices like Shibari, the Japanese art of knot tying as an example, is being combined with furniture making. And that is very high end at the moment, I confess, but I look forward to, and I can't wait to see how that filters down into the mass market as well.  
Sue: I absolutely agree. And it's also about heritage. So we're seeing antiques come back in, particularly in furniture and luxury interiors. This idea of what is authentic and old and traditional is really starting to reemerge, which is exciting. But this idea of the ancient... We went to High Point last week and we were at Eichholtz, which is a Dutch furniture manufacturer, and it's really, really luxurious and beautiful. And they had curated a collection where their creative director went to the Metropolitan Museum of Art into the archives, and looked at the Egyptian art and ancient practices to inspire their new collection. And I think that story is really going to emerge because people want to... We don't want to feel manufactured. We want to feel authentic. We want it to not look like it came out of a box or an Amazon truck. We're going to really want to see that authenticity. And that speaks to that earthy nature of what you were talking about. I think it's a really exciting trend to watch.  Daniel: It really does. And glyphs and symbols are hugely important to that process as well, and I think those are becoming really, really popular too. And again, it's just speaking to the same narrative.  
Sue: And from a color perspective, I would equate that to the richness of color. So it won't just be about light and airy. These archival colors, if you will, they're rich, they're deep, they're browns and sepias and reds. You get this idea of antiquity, and they're gorgeous in interiors. So I definitely think that that is something that we're watching as well as we translate to interior design trends for 2026.  
Daniel: The muddy approach.  
Sue: Yes. And of the earth, not nature. We all came out of COVID, and it was all about colors of nature. I get it. This is something different. This is of the earth. This is ancient, and it feels really new and exciting. So I'm excited for it too. It'll be great. With all the research and the continual nature of trend forecasting, it never goes to sleep. You never get a break. Is there any room for surprise and things that are new and unexpected?  
Daniel: I think there are, but again, I think probably it depends on the person you're talking to. Dare I say Barbie pink? That was a huge surprise for me.  
Sue: Yes. Right. 
Daniel: I never expected the film to do as well as it did, and I was blown away by the global appetite for this color. It was astonishing and somewhat scary. And I'm sure some people are throwing me off the edge of a cliff for saying that. But yeah, that was definitely unexpected for me.  
Sue: Yes, I would totally agree with that. Have you seen something that's new on the horizon, without giving too much away, that you're excited for from a specific color direction perspective? Something that we haven't seen?  
Daniel: I'm not sure that you haven't seen it, but I'm definitely... We're constantly looking at where color families and so forth are shifting. I was talking to a colleague the other day, and we were discussing this clear monumental shift away from those really cold neutrals that have been extremely popular in more of a direction for those warm tones. And I think it's quite nice as well, at the moment, we're seeing a shift away from some of those shaded, neutral greens in favor of more bright, pale yellow greens that are starting to act more as statement colors, rather than accents or contrasts.  
Sue: I would agree with that. For here in the U.S., it's a little green undertone, like mossy, so it's a little bit more on the utility side. And I particularly love that color, so I'm excited to see it. And khakis, so green undertone neutrals, not necessarily a green, but green undertones are coming back in and what we're tracking with our forecast. So I'm excited to see how that develops as well, because we haven't talked about khakis in 15 years probably. I think it's going to be fun to talk about. Well, what has been, outside of Barbie pink and the unexpected nature of it, what's been your most favorite recent color moment? Do you have one?  
Daniel: That's a tough one as well. You know what? I'm going to keep it mainstream, and I'm probably going to go with IKEA's collaboration with Dutch design studio Raw Color. The Tesamman, I'm sure I've said that wrong, product line that came out of that was completely unexpected, but it felt so considered. And I just love anything that's joyful and playful. And I think it really sparked interest for me, it was because it was quite a large step away from IKEA's normal color landscape, as it were. So I'm not sure if that has launched in the U.S., but it is definitely-  
Sue: I'm not familiar. Could you describe it? Is it about bold brights? How is it different than what IKEA usually publishes?  
Daniel: I'm not sure I would define it as bold brights, but it's certainly brighter than IKEA's normal muted Scandi palette.  
Sue: Yeah. Sure.  
Daniel: But it was really, really quite interesting. I'm pretty sure it was at Milan this year. It was certainly at Dutch Design Week a couple of weeks ago as well. There's been a lot of stuff on it, but it's really unexpected, and I think it's definitely... Have a look. It's really cool. The selection of colors, they're really quite lovely, and it really stands out as, I think, showcasing IKEA's ability to constantly push boundaries and keep them relevant.  
Sue: Push the envelope.  
Daniel: Yeah.  
Sue: I love it. Yeah, that's a huge part of this job. It's what keeps us up at night. You just don't want to be the same thing over and over again. And those color moments, that's a great responsibility because they have such big impact on audiences. So this has been a wonderful conversation. I so appreciate you taking the time. How can people find you? I know people are going to want to know more about Colour Hive.  
Daniel: Well, www.colourhive.com for sure. Go to the website, sign up for our newsletter, look at our journals page. We've got some really interesting journal pieces on the shows we visit, color directions, material directions. And then of course, follow us on Insta or Facebook, and even LinkedIn is a great spot. But hopefully, you'll find us at the next biggest and best design show as we circle exhibition halls, delving into the weird and wonderful of whatever we can find to help beef up our research in terms of future directions.  
Sue: Well, keep up the good work. I absolutely love what you guys produce, and you're such a good partner and good friends. So thanks for joining us, and I'm excited to see what 2027... Are we talking '27? Almost. Soon. It's going to be published soon, right?  
Daniel: We are actually... Well, yes. Yeah, we're talking '26, '27 from December. But yeah, we are on our way in that direction.  
Sue: That's crazy. Crazy. We'll be 2030 before we know it, which is mind-blowing. Not yet. Not yet. We got some time. All right. Well, thanks, Daniel. We really appreciate it and we hope you had fun.  
Daniel: I did. Thank you, Sue. Thanks for having me. It's been a blast. And have a colorful rest of the day.  

Sue: Our next guest is Kelsea Olivia from East Olivia in Manhattan. Hi, Kelsea. It's so great to see you again.  
Kelsea: Hi, Sue. How are you this morning?  
Sue: I am wonderful. So for everybody that's listening, tell us who is East Olivia, and how did you get your start in this wonderful world that you live in? And tell us, tell us everything.  
Kelsea: Well, let's see. Where to start? Gosh. Well, I worked for 10 years in the music industry, basically right out of high school, college. Loved it, learned a lot, but got a little burnout, wanted to do something a little bit more visually creative. And I'm from Southern California, so when I was in music, everything was in L.A. I moved to New York in 2011 now. Crazy.  
Sue: Wow. Yeah.  Kelsea: And was looking for something new and different, and trying to figure out what I wanted to do with my career. And since I was new to New York, I was like, "You know what? I'm going to work for Anthropologie, just to meet some friends, try to figure out what I want to do next." And that ended up being such a crazy stepping stone for me because it was really just like, "Hey, I'm going to take this job, but it's not too serious." And then I ended up getting into flowers while working at Anthropologie. I started working for their bridal line, which at the time was called BHLDN, now it's just called Anthropologie Weddings. And we needed flowers for the shop. And so I had to go to the flower market here in New York. And that was really it for me, going onto 28th Street, walking into all of the wholesalers that are on that street, which, if you live in New York and you've never been, you have to... Even just walking down the street, it's chaotic, for sure, because it's a bunch of floral vendors and then hotels. So it's like people with suitcases, and then a lot of people working, trying to carry trees and plants and flowers. It's crazy. So anyway, I just fell in love with the flower market, started doing flowers for Anthropologie, BHLDN. And what was so great is that a district manager that is still to this day a very dear friend and mentor of mine, her aunt owns this incredible florist shop in the Hamptons. And so, that district manager was very well versed in florals and saw what I was doing and thought I was good at it. So she kept giving me more opportunities. And I eventually started doing all fresh cut florals and plants for all the Anthropologie stores in New York, also running our events and also doing Instagram. It was really fun. It was like seven jobs-  
Sue: Yes.  
Kelsea: ... in one. But yeah, that's how I got into it. And I think what's so cool is that my music industry experience was really a lot of marketing, artist management, all those skill sets, while very different, played so beautifully into me working at Anthro and working in this creative field. And then while I was at Anthro, I moonlit and started to build East Olivia. And I think the biggest turning point for me was really, I sent a cold email to this women's conference called Create & Cultivate, because I really loved what they were doing. They were just providing these conferences and programming to really support women in their careers. And I've always been very entrepreneurial, even since I was little. And so I cold emailed them, and I was like, "I love what you guys are doing. I'm passionate about the work that you're doing. I'd love to do flowers for one of your events." And I was so new, and they said yes, which I was so excited, but I thought it was just going to be some arrangements, and it ended up being a 15 by 10 foot suspended installation.  
Sue: Oh, my gosh.  
Kelsea: And I had never done anything like that before. It was crazy.  
Sue: So talk about that a little bit. You are not just a floral designer. You create installations and execute florals on a huge scale. So talk about that a little bit.  
Kelsea: Yeah. Well, I love scale. It's so fun. And doing that large scale installation actually was so amazing and was what got me hooked on that kind of work. And what I really loved about it is that it's not something I could do by myself. It requires a team. It requires expertise beyond what I even, especially at that point, knew myself. And it was really my creative community in New York and at Anthropologie that helped me look like an expert when I really knew nothing. And that conference had so many corporate sponsors. And I saw this sort of opportunity, again, me being entrepreneurial is an understatement.  
Sue: Yes, I would say so.  
Kelsea: Yeah. And so I was like, "I want to keep doing more work for this conference." And I ended up becoming their exclusive florist for several years. We're not exclusive with them any more, but we still work with them all the time, and it's great. Sometimes it really makes sense, other times it doesn't. But I started to work with so many corporate brands. And as we all know, over the last several years with social media, Instagram, TikTok, all those things, it's really important for brands and clients in general, even on the social wedding and mitzvah sides, people want to create moments that encourage people to share online and with each other and all of that. So I really became an expert in that area, and really taking whatever the brand's messaging was and finding a way to express that through florals. And it's really challenging and fun. And part of what I like about it is actually the restriction of corporate brand colors, and then having to get creative within those constraints. I think it's really fun. But yeah, back to the scale, it's so amazing to see something orchestrated and come together that takes many, many hands. And I think as a creative, and I'm sure you can relate, there can be ego and attachment and expressions of ourselves that we want to see, and I really like how the large scale pushes against that inclination, and it makes me grow in that way, and I really like that.  
Sue: Well, and we'll obviously give your social handle so people can see the work, but when we had the privilege of meeting a few weeks ago, and it blew my mind just how creative... You're part carpenter as you build these massive installations and experiences, but how do you keep it fresh? How do you keep things moving and new and exciting and dynamic? Where's your favorite source of inspiration?  
Kelsea: Well, my favorite source of inspiration is fashion. Really for me, I love seeing what other floral designers are doing, but at the same time, I don't want, whether it's my feed or the things that I'm looking at or taking in that other people in my field are working on, I try to have that be limited, just because I don't want to regurgitate somebody else's work. So finding inspiration outside of my industry is really important. And fashion has just always been a love of mine. I mean, I have a ridiculous closet. And fashion, for me, getting dressed is the first creative thing I do every day. And it's really where I see fashion designers, especially on a commercial, larger scale, they're some of the biggest artists in the world that are pushing interesting color stories, textures, really pushing the envelope with shape and scale and all of those things. And I just love to see the playfulness and the pushing of the envelope that we get from fashion. And so, that's really where I get most of my inspiration. Then of course, nature. I mean, seasonality with florals is really important, and a big part of the job is understanding your ingredients. And there are things that you can get all year round, roses, carnations, which people like to [inaudible 00:40:46] on both those [inaudible 00:40:47] those are some of my two favorite kinds of flowers. There are hundreds of flowers you can get all year round, but nature is really this incredible gift, this cyclical calendar of it. And understanding blue, for instance, like blue flowers are really hard. There aren't a ton of options, and it's very seasonal in terms of what you can get. And so, looking to nature and the way that color palettes even come together in nature on their own without us touching it is a really beautiful way to be inspired with color and texture and shape and all those things as well.  
Sue: I totally love that. We're going to talk about that in a minute, but I want to go back to the fashion inspiration. So obviously, this is a podcast and people have to listen and put a visual together.  
Kelsea: Yeah.  Sue: So can you describe a moment in fashion that you translated into a floral concept, and link those together?  
Kelsea: Yes. Okay. So my favorite story is meeting my favorite designer, actually whose sweater I'm wearing right now. Her name is Mara Hoffman. Huge inspiration to me. She has always worked with a lot of color and pushed the boundaries, I feel like, of maybe what you might think would go together, and making it feel effortless. And that's something I really take pride in being able to do in my work as well. So there's one day I was at the New York City flower market, and I'm pretty extroverted, sociable, all those things.  
Sue: Yes. Sure.  
Kelsea: I don't really get nervous. I worked in music, so I know, working with celebrities, all that kind of stuff. I'm very chill about those things. But I was in the flower market and I saw Mara Hoffman herself, in the market. And I was like, "Oh my gosh, my idol is here." So I remember getting really nervous. And my friend who is a wholesaler at the market actually really made fun of me. He's like, "I've never seen you be nervous before." He's like, "That was hilarious." I'm like, "I'm glad you thought it was funny." [inaudible 00:42:42]  
Sue: Thanks.  
Kelsea: But anyway, I just-  
Sue: Terrifying.  
Kelsea: I was terrified. But I went up and spoke to her. And I was like, "Hi." I introduced myself. I'm like, "You inspire my work so much. I would love to do flowers for you. If there's any opportunity, please let me know." And so then we emailed back and forth. She had a press preview that she was doing for a collection that year, and she sent me photos of the collection. I chose vases and florals that I felt like were an expression of that line. And I remember getting to bring them into her office and PR suite where she was showcasing the collection. And it was, for me, one of the coolest experiences I've just ever had in my tenure as a florist. I love that story so much.  
Sue: You mentioned parameters and guidelines. So we had the great, great privilege of working with you on our 2025 color capsule of the year. We wanted to do an activation that was outside of the paint space, and create a moment, a color moment to inspire people to think about our nine colors in a unique way. So we partnered together to create a forever floral bouquet. And so, talk about that project, and what was your driving factor in what you created, and talk about what you created. I would like to tell people about that a little bit.  
Kelsea: Yeah, absolutely. So outside of our large scale installations and our event work, which is a big bulk of what we do, in the pandemic, I launched our Forever Florals. And we've been doing dried and preserved for a long time. I actually got into dried and preserved florals when I worked in retail because so many things would die. And that was many years ago, and the product was not at all as prevalent or on trend as it is today. So it's really fun to see how it's evolved over the years. And the same joy and excitement I get from working with color and those parameters with our event work, I feel the same about our Forever Florals. So working with Sherwin was such a dream come true. I mean, our Forever Florals are a home decor item. They really, really are. And I love that they're forever. Not everybody has a green thumb. I actually don't. People like to ask me about plants all the time, and I'm like, "Guys, I'm not your girl. Let me give you somebody else's number. I could tell you what plant that is, but you don't want me taking care of it."  Sue: Yeah, it's a lot to nurture a plant and take care of it.  Kelsea: It is.  
Sue: My mom is the same way. She's amazing with plants. I am not amazing with plants, so it's-  
Kelsea: She didn't pass that down to you? That's not very nice.  
Sue: She didn't. She didn't. I know.  
Kelsea: Yeah. They're a lot of work, and especially in New York, and you're in Ohio, there's just seasons. It's a lot.  
Sue: Yes.  
Kelsea: And even fresh cut flowers can be tough for some people, just the upkeep of something that is alive. So I love our Forever Floral product. I love how it is this piece in your home that can really be something that is an expression of yourself. And the color palette that we have been working on together was so fun. I love just these soft purples, the muted yellows, beautiful brown, colors that really feel warm and inviting in your home. And so it was really fun to take that palette and look at seasonal ingredients. We have some beautiful fall grasses that are incorporated that are really neutral. And the inspiration for this, in partnership with you guys, of course, this incredible color palette, and then creating something that really anybody would be able to put in a space in their home, and be able to gift as well. Our two main customers are really people that want to share flowers in celebration or in memoriam or as some expression to someone else that they love, or an expression of their selves in their home. And what a special thing. Flowers are so special in that way. Throughout just history, the way that they are used to express love towards each other or express ourselves in our spaces is really cool. And so, wanting to create something that really would appeal to the masses, and that it's not special, but something that's neutral, but has these really fun pops that feel like they could be very universal. And that's one of the things I love about the final products.  
Sue: I agree. And I think what was so great is, it's just teaching people that it doesn't have to be painted on a wall to be transformational. You can use moments like plants or Forever Florals to enhance a space and tell a color story, if maybe you're not ready to commit to painting a room a deep celery color or something, whatever that might be. So I loved how we partnered together on this. I thought it was really clever and unique. And I got to meet you, which was the best part of all of this.  
Kelsea: I mean, that was so fun. And I love that working with dried and preserved florals allowed us to actually paint the ingredients with Sherwin-Williams paint. That is so cool.  
Sue: Me too. That was cool.  
Kelsea: So if you get one of these arrangements and you decide to have an accent wall or something, or maybe two in your space, that feature some of these colors, the pop of that is so fun. And I love... I don't know, I just love the play aspect of that and getting to truly just paint the ingredients and make them look exactly however we wanted.  
Sue: But they didn't look painted. They looked like they were authentically... grow that way, and were dried and preserved. It was really cool. So talk a little bit, since this episode's about trends, where have you seen the rise of dried and preserved florals come from? Because for a long time, anybody was just interested in fresh.  
Kelsea: Right. Yeah, it's so interesting. I think it's just with trends, things can be cyclical. And I think that there was that whole era in the '70s with Golden Girls pampas grass off in the corner in their Miami house. It could feel a little dated and [inaudible 00:48:52] stuffy-  
Sue: Hundred percent, yes.  
Kelsea: I think people think of their... I like to say our Forever Florals are not your grandmother's dried florals. They're not the potpourri on the back of the toilet seat in the bathroom. Because dried flowers for many years were seen as that. And some people actually don't like the idea of dried flowers because they're not living. But I am very sentimental. And the ephemeral, fresh, things that we cannot keep, that teaches me so much. But I love that we can hold onto something a little bit longer from nature as well.  
Sue: Yeah, there's a sustainability aspect to that, for those people that don't want fresh, they want something that's going to live a long time that they don't have to constantly replace, and it's better for the environment. So there's multiple stories there. I just love the dried nature of it from a color perspective. You take something that was once alive and vibrant, and it patinas and changes as it dries out and it becomes something new. So that's what's unexpected about it.  
Kelsea: Yeah.  
Sue: And also beautiful. That's my favorite thing. I love dried florals.  
Kelsea: Yeah, I love that about it too. And I think maybe some of the resurgence of the trend is like, I see this all the time in floristry, and I'm sure in other industries too, but you can take something like, I don't know, a calla lily, which for me, honestly, a couple years ago, I'd have been like, "Ugh, no thanks." But I use them all the time now. And it's so fun to take something that feels tired or old or just in the past, and how can we make it fresh and new? How can we make it something that's new and different? We don't have to use it the same way that we used to use it. And so for us, with dried florals, playing with color and vibrancy, and I think there has also been a lot of development in the product itself and what wholesalers offer. And you can of course dry some of your own flowers. A lot of people think that I dry flowers. I do not. I source them from wholesalers. Sometimes I do cut things off the side of the road, though. I will say, I've been known to do it.  
Sue: So, based on that, I went and harvested some grasses off the side of the road when I was so inspired by one of the arrangements in the workshop, in the office.  
Kelsea: Oh my gosh. I love that.  
Sue: I had never thought to do that before, but because I had talked to you and we had talked about that, I was like, "I'm totally going to do this."  
Kelsea: You totally can. It's amazing.  
Sue: Yes.  
Kelsea: I mean, always be careful about where you're foraging. Ohio is probably way better place than New York. I remember when I started getting into foraging, one of my wholesaler friends was like, he's like, "This is New York. Be careful. You can't be going into Central Park cutting things down. You'll get arrested."  
Sue: Exactly. You totally will. So I would say, caution, everyone. Don't just start chopping stuff down.  
Kelsea: Yeah, make sure you have permission or it really is on the side of the road.  
Sue: Yes, exactly. Yes.  
Kelsea: Yeah.  Sue: What I would say is, people look to you as an inspiration source because you are not the every floral designer that's out there. You take something like a calla lily, which is structural and beautiful, but also very traditional. And so, looking that in a new way, I'm sure that people look to you to break through and create something unexpected and amazing, which is truly the most remarkable part of your work. But I want to bring it back to the idea of color trends. So how does color outside of in the floral industry impact what you're designing, like color forecasting or trends?  
Kelsea: Yeah, I mean, it's a big deal. It impacts so much. I mean, even if you just think about Barbie, and I'm a pink girly, if you can tell from behind me. Lots of pink.  
Sue: Yes.  
Kelsea: And that's a color that I already loved, but that really vibrant hot pink that was coming out of all the Barbie stuff, that impacted culture a lot from... It trickles down into the everyday consumer products that we're purchasing, which then just puts... It's more the forefront of people's minds. So all this trend forecasting and the people that are like... People like yourself that are making a big difference in the industry and what people on the consumer side are seeing, makes a big impact for people like myself, because it's what people want more of. And I really love how vibrantly color forward trends have been in the last several years. I think it's so fun. And I think there's also the seasonality to it as well. It's exciting to see some people come out with their trend forecasts for colors and them being these bright, vibrant colors that are maybe almost a little bit in juxtaposition too. Because I feel like a lot of these conversations are happening around the fall, the winter, but then they're submerging these bright, vibrant, juicy colors into maybe a time of the year that people aren't thinking about it. And it really just inspires people to think about colors that they maybe wouldn't traditionally, like using a tangerine orange for your wedding. Most people would not think to do that, right?  
Sue: Right.  
Kelsea: But with trends with color, it gets people excited about pushing that envelope I was talking about in the beginning, which for me is where the work is the most fun. Or if we have a client that's like, "Oh, I really love," I don't know, "a citron yellow" or something, how do we make this work and feel like chic and effortless? And that's really where then... And that's what I love about this color palette that we worked on, is like it's got these broad neutrals that really ground the brighter, more fun pops. And it's really fun to see how that can just kind of... I don't know, it makes my job easier, but it makes my job a lot of fun.  
Sue: It's interesting. And I swear we did not plan this. The guest I had on before, his name is Daniel LaDuc, and he's from an organization, a creative agency that works globally on color trends called Colour Hive. And we were talking about unexpected color moments that nobody anticipated, and he mentioned Barbie pink and how that just dropped in as a cultural moment and impacted forecasting in a big way. And maybe it's not going to be trans-seasonal, maybe it was just for last summer, influencing into this year. But what I think is interesting for what you... Because you're so client-focused, how do cultural associations impact florals? If you're working with somebody of Indian descent, are those color choices different than a traditional Northeastern-  
Kelsea: Oh, my gosh, yes.  
Sue: Right. Yeah. So talk about that a little bit.  
Kelsea: An Indian wedding is way more fun. I can tell you that, because that culture and a lot of their expressions and identity have so much more, not even just... Yes, color, but heavily saturated color and a lot of vibrancy. And I think that's why I've been so drawn to brand work over social work. When I say social work, for those of you that don't know, in the industry, that's a term for anything that's not a brand activation or a brand event. So your 40th birthday party, your mitzvah, your wedding, those are all considered social. And I find that those clients play it so much more safe. They are... Especially American clients, to be honest. It's very... And I'm sure they're throughout the world, I feel like probably France, Italy, they're probably more similar to America in terms of color palette, very restrained, very classic. I think people are kind of scared sometimes of color. They feel like, "Oh, if I make this choice, when I look back on this in 20 years, is it going to feel like the wrong choice, or is it going to feel like..." We've all seen people in their wedding dresses in the '80s, and you know that it was the '80s, right? So I think that we have this challenge when we're working with a lot of color, how do we make it feel effortless and timeless? And I know I'm bouncing all over the place, but yes, to your point, culturally, I do see a big difference. I see a big difference between corporate and social. Corporate likes to have more fun, believe it or not.  
Sue: That's great to hear.  
Kelsea: One of my favorite clients is one of the biggest corporate financial institutions with a pretty boring color palette. But when you take that color palette and you put it into floral and you push it and you have fun with it, it's fun to work with bright reds and oranges and a touch of yellow, versus just white on white on white.  
Sue: Right. Well, so would you give people that advice now? And I agree with every single thing that you said. Americans tend to be very risk averse when it comes to color, especially in their interiors. We lean into neutrals really heavily. I am starting to see a change where people are excited about new colors, and we're starting to see these richer, deeper tones come into home, and that's amazing. But what would you say to people who want your energy and want to bring color in? What's your advice?  
Kelsea: Just start. Just start. I love... It's so funny too, because flowers are ephemeral, right? Paint kind of is ephemeral. It can last forever, but you can also just cover it up.  
Sue: Agreed.  Kelsea: So I think we have to also just get more comfortable with change and trying things out, really paying attention to how... I know this may sound hippie-dippy or silly, but really paying attention to how you feel when you're immersed in a certain color, when you see a certain color. Like for me, again, pink. I love pink. I can't even count how many pink things are in my home studio. Pink makes me feel a certain way, and I gravitate towards it. So a lot of my initial advice for somebody who's afraid of color is to really just pay attention to how colors make you feel. Go somewhere like a flower market or an art museum. Go to places where you can be exposed to a lot of color and pay attention to how it makes you feel. It does have a big impact. I mean, lighting has a big impact. All these things, they actually really impact how we feel, at least for me, and I think it's for most people. And if you're not feeling that, you might just be not totally in touch with yourself. That's a different podcast episode.  
Sue: Yes. Yes.  
Kelsea: But that's really my advice, to have fun, play. That's what makes all of this enjoyable. And if you hate it, then just cover it up or buy new flowers. It doesn't have to be forever.  
Sue: It doesn't. That's one of my favorite moments to explore color, is I'll go to art museums. Cleveland has a really, really great art museum. And I don't go to look at the artwork. I go to see color in the spaces and how they bring color to life in the museum. And I just, like you, are immediately immersed in a color and a collection. And I do some research that way. So again, that's just a little insider tip. That's so great. I love that you said the same thing.  
Kelsea: And isn't it so fun to see also too, I love how color... When you combine color, how it affects each other. You could put one color next to another color, and all of a sudden, something that was beautiful now looks sucked of all of its saturation and muted and gray, because it's... You know what I mean? There's life in color. And it's so fun to see how it really morphs and can change your perspective of another color, just by being paired with something. So I think that's so fun.  
Sue: Totally. Well, so one more question. This has been wonderful, but is there... Other than the Barbie moment and your love of pink, has there been another color moment that's captured your imagination or took you by surprise in the last couple of months?  
Kelsea: Let's see. Ooh, that's such a good question. I'm like, "What have I really been gravitating towards lately?" Well, right now, I'm thinking more because we're in fall, more fall things, that what I love is taking a seasonal palette. Like today at the flower market, I was shopping for a very fall forward activation, but rooted in pink and red. So I really like taking-  
Sue: Ooh, pretty.  Kelsea: ... something that... Which I don't know if that exactly answers your question, but that idea of taking something that has maybe always been one way in my brain, like okay, fall foliage, but how do we then layer in these other colors? And then I do have to say, I've been really loving citron so much lately. That's a really fun one and a little unexpected. I love that you were just talking about unexpected color stories. That's truly my favorite, when you see things paired together that you're like, "Huh, that feels so easy, but I never would've put those two things together."  
Sue: Yeah, that's my favorite thing. And I think when you're in this color business, you see those patterns, you immediately recognize when something's new. And you're like, "Oh." Sit back. "Oh, I love that." And those moments are fun. And so again, I love the work that you do. I can't wait for people to check out how they can... So again, let me cut to that. How can people find you? Tell your socials.  
Kelsea: Yes. Okay. So social handles are @eastolivia and @shopeastolivia, and eastolivia.com for our events and activations and all those kinds of things. We're here in New York, but we really operate all over the U.S. for events. And then, if you want to take a little bit of East Olivia and Sherwin-Williams home, shopeastolivia.com, for a limited time though. And they are moving fast, so- Sue: They are. They're wonderful. Well, it's so great to talk to you again. This was a privilege. Thanks for giving your little insider insight into your world. And definitely check out East Olivia. Such beautiful work.  
Kelsea: Awesome. Thank you so much, Sue. This was so much fun.  
Sue: It was. It was great. In our next segment, we're going to speak with Johnathan Ryan Wilson of Interiors by John Ryan in South Florida. John is our January designer of the month and is going to just talk about the project that we're featuring, and also what is his experience with trends, because we always like to take these big ideas and then bring it back to designers that are really doing the work in this space. So hi, John. Welcome to Colormixology.  
Johnathan: Hi, Sue. Thank you so much for having me. I've been looking forward to this for quite some time.  
Sue: I love the painting behind you. Tell us about what that is. I have to ask.  
Johnathan: Yeah, yeah, yeah. So obviously, I source a lot of art from my clients. So when I'm doing my sourcing, I sometimes look for myself. And this one caught my eye. It's from a company called Leftbank. And before I had my own place, I saw this, and I was like, "This is perfect. I'm a bourbon drinker. The colors are fantastic." So this painting really set the tone for the design of my entire house.  
Sue: That is awesome. And for those that are listening in, you have to check out the video. It is a very cool, stylized rendering of a gorgeous gent drinking a just-  Johnathan: Yes.  
Sue: ... buttery, warm glass of bourbon. It looks great. I love it.  
Johnathan: Can I tilt this?  
Sue: You can. 
 Johnathan: There it is.  
Sue: Yes. Yes. That's so great. So tell us about how you started your journey in design. I like for people to listen and get to know our designers. So how did it start? 
 Johnathan: Of course. So I was born in the early '90s, so I remember getting our first computer. And I would play on this computer, not knowing what I was doing, really. And through my exploring, I came across this program that was like a home building program that I didn't know where it came from. And to this day, my parents don't know how it got on the computer. So I just played with that a little bit, and I fell in love with it, where I'd come home from school and I'd just go straight to the computer and start building these houses and cities. And so, I always knew from that moment, design, whether it's architecture, interior design, something in the industry, is what I wanted to do. So as soon as I graduated high school, I enrolled in Berkeley College in New Jersey, which is a CIDA accredited program for interior design. And I loved it. It was fantastic.  
Sue: You've just been going ever since. Yes. 
 Johnathan: Ever since. Yeah.  
Sue: I love it. So then you grew up in the Northeast, but now you're in South Florida?  
Johnathan: Yeah. So after, well during college actually, I had an internship at a small firm in northern New Jersey. I grew up in New York, but probably like an hour and a half north of Manhattan, so our nearest neighbors were half a mile away. So there was really no such thing as design up there, so you really had to travel. So I had an internship there. It was a residential company. I worked there for about six months, I think. And then I decided I wanted to try out commercial design. So I spent two years as an architectural designer, again, in northern New Jersey. And we were responsible for things like putting together construction drawings for Starbucks and CVS and Aldi. And then I realized it really wasn't letting me be the creative that I like to think I am. Because they already have their set designs and everything. So after that, I decided I was going to move somewhere warm because I was over the cold weather.  
Sue: Yes.  
Johnathan: And I picked South Florida, and here we are. Actually, two days ago, I celebrated my third year anniversary of Interiors by John Ryan.  
Sue: That is fantastic. So in the show notes, it just explains that you have a wealth of experience in both residential, commercial and architectural design, and now you're leading your own company, which is fantastic.  
Johnathan: My own company. Yes.  
Sue: So I think in this platform, you're the first South Florida designer that we've talked about. So tell us about the market. What's it like to design in Florida? I can only imagine-  
Johnathan: Oh, my gosh.  
Sue: ... how fun it is. 
 Johnathan: It's fantastic. Coming from New York where there really wasn't much... I'm going to say upstate New York, not New York City.  
Sue: Right.  
Johnathan: There wasn't much design. And all the design that there was, it was very dark and dreary, I'm going to say. So moving to South Florida, I took a position with a high-end residential firm. And it was a challenge trying to understand what South Florida design was without bringing in that... Because it's so different. It's so different.  
Sue: What are the differences? I know what my perceived differences are, that it's all about vibrancy, because there's so much color outside, but is that truly the case?  
Johnathan: Yeah. So it is and it isn't. So I'll say, West Palm Beach style is all vibrancy. You have these big vibrant patterns of palm leaves and color drenching and all of this color. It's amazing. But the further south that you go, really between West Palm Beach and I'd say Fort Lauderdale, we have this very neutral tone that we're bringing in muted colors, like subtle. We don't use a ton of it, but West Palm Beach and Miami, you're seeing color everywhere.  
Sue: Do you think that's because people have big expansive windows? They see what's going on outside, so they want their interiors to feel a little more restrained? Or is it just-  
Johnathan: Yeah, they do.  
Sue: ... cultural differences?  Johnathan: A lot of the work that we do is on the east, towards the water. So yeah, we're always doing work on inter-coastal, and people are... There's more windows than there are walls. You're absolutely right.  Sue: Of course. Yes, of course. But then there's a lot of influence. Florida is such a melting pot of people, that you get a lot of the Northeast, right? On the east coast of Florida. So I wonder if that influence comes down for the neutrals and...  Johnathan: For sure. South Florida is... You get New York, New Jersey, Connecticut, and a sprinkle of people who come from Canada who are on the South Florida. So when they move, they usually... I work with a lot of new builds, so they'll send me pictures or listings of their previous home. And it's all the same. It's all very northern, dark and everything. So I think when they move to South Florida, these clients want to go outside of their comfort zone just a little bit. So they like to stick with the neutrals, because they don't want to jump head first into the West Palm Beach or the Miami style. So I think that's where it comes in, for sure.  
Sue: Yeah, definitely. And then I can see, like you said, pops of color. So beautiful artwork, beautiful furniture, accent colors come in that way, and you keep your walls pretty neutral, which I guess in my mind, that's how new Florida feels. Not the Golden Girls Florida with the palm leaves and the '80s trellis. That is also in the back of my mind. I loved that show, back in the day. I would watch it with my mom. So I just have this very fond nostalgia factor for Florida, because it is such a melting pot of great design.  
Johnathan: It is.  
Sue: So in this episode, we're talking about color trends and how this trend forecasting world impacts design. So does that influence your work at all, the idea of what a trend is or how color is moving?  
Johnathan: It does. It does, because we look to you to lead us, because for myself, I usually start with an area rug when I design.  
Sue: Do people pay attention to trends down there, or do they want really just classics?  
Johnathan: No, they definitely pay attention to trends, especially the clientele down here, which is mostly housewives. They always are looking for the next best thing. So we're influenced by so much, whether it's social media or something you see on TV, everybody wants the next thing.  
Sue: The next it thing. Oh, that's interesting.  
Johnathan: The next it thing. Yeah. And I think that's more prevalent down here, just because of the lifestyle that the clients have.  
Sue: They're seeking that. You know what? And I'm curious about exteriors. So everybody has a preconceived notion of South Florida exteriors, but I think it's different than what we think. It's not like Key West style, right?  
Johnathan: No.  
Sue: So what do you see as like... For single-family homes in South Florida, what's trending in exteriors?  
Johnathan: Super modern, super clean. Everything is white, gray, or black. And sometimes we'll use little accents of wood under like [inaudible 01:11:32] or a little stonework, but everything is so clean, very contemporary. You're seeing a lot of that happening now in these communities, that they're tearing down all the old world Florida, and they're just building these-  Sue: Modern.  
Johnathan: Yes.  
Sue: Fascinating. That's fascinating. So we're starting to talk about how more classic design is coming back in. And that was what was really showing in Europe in the spring, and ornamentation, even on cabinetry for your kitchen. We haven't seen that sort of detail in a while, so I wonder if that's... It takes a while to affect exteriors, but how ornamentation will come back in probably towards 2030 is going to be interesting to track, particularly in Florida where I would not think of classic, modernist style for exteriors.  
Johnathan: Yeah. And it's funny, because down here in Florida, especially the more west you go, it's all communities. So you don't really get a lot of custom-built homes. So what I mean by that is, you go into these communities, and you get to pick... There's different models that you get to choose from. And you can't really deviate from those models too much. So the more east you go in Florida, the more chances you are to see some of these custom homes where you could see a home that you might see in Connecticut just placed somewhere in South Florida. And then as you're driving by, you're looking, it just seems so out of place, but it's beautiful. So I hope that we start to go that direction, because some people might think these homes are so cold and there's no character, and they're kind of right.  
Sue: Yeah. And they're kind of right. It's very minimalist. One of my favorite things to do when we go on vacation is not to go to the beach, but to get in the car and just drive around and look at all the neighborhoods, because it's just eye candy. It's so beautiful in South Florida, and you are lucky to be designing there. So this was awesome. I totally appreciate your insight. I feel like we're going to be friends. And when I have questions about South Florida colors-  
Johnathan: I hope so.  
Sue: ... I'm going to be calling you. 
 Johnathan: Please.  
Sue: So how can people find your work? How can they find you?  
Johnathan: Yeah, so I have a website. It's interiorsbyjohnryan.com. That's also my Instagram. I'm also starting a podcast.  
Sue: Yay.  
Johnathan: So it's called DESIGN. DRINK. DISH. So-  
Sue: Fabulous.  
Johnathan: Yeah. It's going to be just like a take, getting into the nitty-gritty of it all, because there's a stigma that interior designers... Like our jobs are super luxurious, and we dress fancy. And that is just not the case. So we are boots on the ground.  
Sue: Yes. In fact, I've been talking about that. It's my favorite thing. We talk to so many luxury designers. And at the end of the day, they still get annoyed at employees and have to go to the hardware store and have to go on a job site and dust. It is not glamorous. It's a little glamorous, but not every day. It's great.  
Johnathan: Yeah. I mean, I show up to work in shorts and a t-shirt, because when I'm doing installs, I'm on the ground, I'm laying rugs, I'm moving furniture, and I just can't do that in-  
Sue: Yes, in a suit. Like, come on. Come on.  
Johnathan: ... a suit and a tie.  
Sue: Oh, that's awesome. Well, good luck to you. That is going to be awesome. I will definitely listen in. When is your launch date? Do you have a timing yet?  
Johnathan: So I just recorded my intro, so we're looking at about two weeks.  
Sue: Awesome.  
Johnathan: Yes.  
Sue: Well, good luck to you. If you ever need a guest, call me.  
Johnathan: Oh, I'm sure.  
Sue: It'd be fun.  
Johnathan: Oh, you're the first one.  
Sue: I love it. Well, thank you so much for your time. It was great talking to you. And congratulations and good luck.  
Johnathan: Thank you, Sue. Appreciate it.  
Sue: Thanks so much for listening. To explore our 2025 color mix forecast capsules and order paint samples, visit swcolorforecast.com. If you enjoyed this conversation, be sure to subscribe. Let us know what you think with the review, and tell the design and color loving people in your life about this podcast. Tune in next time for a conversation with Jenna Gaidusek, the interior eDesign guru who's mastered the art of virtual collaboration and designing in the age of AI. See you next time on Colormixology.  Voiceover: This podcast was produced in partnership with Amaze Media Labs.